Ol' Girl gets a new Ol' Girl

[Toni]

I had hoped that I might get to use the boat with a new floor by Pink season but it may not happen. When I was talking with Steve he paints a beautiful picture of what it will be like when done. Bilge pump. Kicker bracket. Putting a fish box in the floor. Floor will be gelcoat and textured I think he said. I got blue to add to the white so it will be light blue. Toe hold on the side. New wiring. The insulation is cracking on the current wiring. When he sanded the transom he found some holes he says "The transom has a row of holes about 1/2" in diameter all the way across about 12" apart that were never filled, just glassed over. I can only imagine they must have been used to clamp the transom onto the hull, but odd they were just skinned over. They'll get filled either with peanut butter or epoxied wood dowels, haven't decided as of yet. The keel will get some resin to fill voids and a nice layer of glass first thing as well as the transom so I can hose the whole thing out and get it spotless before any other glass work begins."

stuff to use to make Peanut butter

peanutbutter stuff.jpg (80.45 KiB) Viewed 6434 times

Looking toward the front

looking toward front.jpg (73.25 KiB) Viewed 6434 times

What is left to be sanded in the front

front and what is left.jpg (80.83 KiB) Viewed 6434 times

[/color]

[Toni]

Looking at the transom

looking back toward transome.jpg (74.32 KiB) Viewed 6429 times

transom.jpg (65 KiB) Viewed 6429 times

Talking about what to do with Steve

Steve at the boat.jpg (82.62 KiB) Viewed 6429 times

[MotoBoat]

I had hoped that I might get to use the boat with a new floor by Pink season but it may not happen. When I was talking with Steve he paints a beautiful picture of what it will be like when done. Bilge pump. Kicker bracket. Putting a fish box in the floor. Floor will be gelcoat and textured I think he said. I got blue to add to the white so it will be light blue. Toe hold on the side. New wiring. The insulation is cracking on the current wiring. When he sanded the transom he found some holes he says "The transom has a row of holes about 1/2" in diameter all the way across about 12" apart that were never filled, just glassed over. I can only imagine they must have been used to clamp the transom onto the hull, but odd they were just skinned over. They'll get filled either with peanut butter or epoxied wood dowels, haven't decided as of yet. The keel will get some resin to fill voids and a nice layer of glass first thing as well as the transom so I can hose the whole thing out and get it spotless before any other glass work begins."

A sentence from the above paragraph: "The transom has a row of holes about 1/2" in diameter all the way across about 12" apart that were never filled, just glassed over. I can only imagine they must have been used to clamp the transom onto the hull"

Are you thinking the transom had issues that requiring a bolted on bracket? That also, sounds much like transom wood rot test holes? That one previous owner may have performed before your taking ownership.

Did the motor from the first boat, the red boat...........sell?

[Toni]

I had hoped that I might get to use the boat with a new floor by Pink season but it may not happen. When I was talking with Steve he paints a beautiful picture of what it will be like when done. Bilge pump. Kicker bracket. Putting a fish box in the floor. Floor will be gelcoat and textured I think he said. I got blue to add to the white so it will be light blue. Toe hold on the side. New wiring. The insulation is cracking on the current wiring. When he sanded the transom he found some holes he says "The transom has a row of holes about 1/2" in diameter all the way across about 12" apart that were never filled, just glassed over. I can only imagine they must have been used to clamp the transom onto the hull, but odd they were just skinned over. They'll get filled either with peanut butter or epoxied wood dowels, haven't decided as of yet. The keel will get some resin to fill voids and a nice layer of glass first thing as well as the transom so I can hose the whole thing out and get it spotless before any other glass work begins."

A sentence from the above paragraph: "The transom has a row of holes about 1/2" in diameter all the way across about 12" apart that were never filled, just glassed over. I can only imagine they must have been used to clamp the transom onto the hull"

Are you thinking the transom had issues that requiring a bolted on bracket? That also, sounds much like transom wood rot test holes? That one previous owner may have performed before your taking ownership.

Did the motor from the first boat, the red boat...........sell?

He thinks the holes were from the time of manufacture, not at a later date. No not rot test holes. There were many air pockets as well near the hull that left gaps which he will fill.
The motor from the first boat did sell. It looked brand new when it sold.

[SoDakboy]

Toni, bravo you are one patient lady. I can't imagine the stress that the ol' red gave you. And I bet you are 'bout ready to do double back flips to finally take ol' blue out.

[Toni]

FROM STEVE: So here's where we're at currently, it's been a busy week on the Crestliner, lots of progress this week. Always surprising what little issues I find as I go along, this week many decisions were made and the fixes were done.

A couple of weeks ago I finished sanding the rest of the hull.

pic 1.jpg (90.01 KiB) Viewed 6198 times

pic 2.jpg (84.47 KiB) Viewed 6198 times

This has been a tedious process as instead of just sanding to rough up the surface, I spent a lot of time removing the old stringer tabbing, as it was not done very well and not saturated enough to glass on top of it - pretty dry. It was obvious what they did during manufacture was take wet glass mats and lay it on to a dry hull and press it down somewhat rather than roll it out, but hey, it worked I suppose. Also notice all the air pockets along the keel beam - not Ugly Bayliner approved.

The next step Monday was to remove the side shelves, as they would interfere with putting the floor sheets in full width - they were obviously added after the original floor was installed, we'll do the same. I then had to sand some more around where the shelves were glassed to the transom and the boat sides near the transom. This will allow a nice sheet of glass to be laid over the whole transom and nothing to interfere with transom tabbing - nothing to go around.

pic 3.jpg (105.32 KiB) Viewed 6198 times

[Toni]

pic 4.jpg (101.31 KiB) Viewed 6196 times

As I was sanding the transom down to get to the wood surface and remove most of the glass as it was dry and splotchy and very inconsistent, I kept uncovering 1/2" holes in the transom wood. By the time I was done, there were more than a dozen and I was baffled as to why they were there. I deduced they must have been air relief holes from when the wood was laid down onto the glass originally so that no air was trapped behind the plywood. Why they weren't filled is beyond me, there wasn't very much glass sealing them closed, in fact one had a slight bit of moisture come out when I "broke the seal". I gave it a day to dry out, but the wood wasn't wet to begin with, just strange to find moisture.

Wednesday was spent finishing the sanding of the transom, then I mixed up some peanut butter - resin with the glass sanding dust I saved from sanding the hull, a 36 grit disc made some pretty nice sized dust, more like dirt! It made for some pretty nice fairing compound, I used the rounded corner of a yellow plastic spreader as an applicator to give me a nice rounded corner for the glass to lay into. You can also see all the holes in the transom plywood. Odd thing, the transom plywood wasn't glassed to the hull at the top edges, probably the top 6" or so, possibly where the cap was installed onto the hull and was just never glassed in. The plywood wasn't coated in resin or glass at that area either, but it sure is now! If the cap ever has to be removed, it will be far more difficult when I'm finished, that's for sure!

pic 5.jpg (84.05 KiB) Viewed 6196 times

I also used the peanut butter to fill in all the air pockets along the keel wood, didn't want to fill with just resin as it would get too hot and most likely crack, plus have no strength. The peanut butter dries very hard and strong, I'm quite impressed with it.

pic 6.jpg (99.94 KiB) Viewed 6196 times

[Toni]

Yesterday morning was spent plugging the holes with wood dowels and epoxy.

pic 7.jpg (103.55 KiB) Viewed 6194 times

Crazy, huh? Maybe they were air pockets for floatation!!!

Next the plugs were cut flush with a multi-tool and sanded smooth with the transom and the transom was tabbed to the hull with resin and some 6" CSM tape that was donated by ondarvr, made it real easy to just roll it out and cut it to length as I went along.

pic 8.jpg (117.63 KiB) Viewed 6194 times

Then the transom was glassed with some very nice triax cloth, a whole roll probably 300' was also donated by ondarvr. This is some very impressive glass, it's a high performance +45, -45, 0 knitted triaxial cloth, which means it has three layers the first is width wise, the next is 45 degrees from the top, the bottom is 45 degrees the other direction and all three layers are stitched together into a matt. This is is much stronger than the woven cloth most commonly available that you see everywhere, it's used in modern hull construction as it is far stronger and withstands far greater impact. The nice part too, it has no binders so it can be used with epoxy or poly resin. I'll be using it to glass the stringers in also, I've never used it before but it is fantastic glass matt! It also leaves a nice finished surface, great tooth for the next layers to bond onto.

pic 9.jpg (89.52 KiB) Viewed 6194 times

[Toni]

Then the keel was given a nice thick layer of resin and 10" wide CSM tape, probably 8 or 10 oz., very thick and it ate up a lot of resin, but it is very strong.

pic 10.jpg (93.96 KiB) Viewed 6191 times

Yes, I glassed over the drain hole. There were some issues around the drain hole brass, it wasn't filled in around it very well, air pockets and crusty glass. It was also sanded flush with the transom plywood and will be drilled out and dressed when the hull glass is finished. That will be nice, as that will now mean I can feel good enough to hose and wash this thing out, it's filthy!!

This morning I cut a large piece of the same triax matt to fit over half of the entire hull.

pic 11.jpg (105.65 KiB) Viewed 6191 times

Yes, I glassed over the drain hole. There were some issues around the drain hole brass, it wasn't filled in around it very well, air pockets and crusty glass. It was also sanded flush with the transom plywood and will be drilled out and dressed when the hull glass is finished. That will be nice, as that will now mean I can feel good enough to hose and wash this thing out, it's filthy!!

This morning I cut a large piece of the same triax matt to fit over half of the entire hull.

pic 12.jpg (102.99 KiB) Viewed 6191 times

[Toni]

The next couple of hours was spent glassing this down to the hull.

pic 13.jpg (118.04 KiB) Viewed 6186 times

pic 14.jpg (123.68 KiB) Viewed 6186 times

This was laid in one full length piece, uncut to maintain maximum strength and performance. The ability of this mat to conform to irregular surfaces, curves and corners is also quite impressive, you can't do this with a tightly woven mat. There is a 4-6" overlap at the keel, the other side will overlap the same amount to really reinforce the keel. This took a lot of resin, nearly 144 ounces in three batches, 48 ounces at a time. That is about the maximum amount I want to mix due to the volume of resin and the heat it produces. To mix it all in one big bucket, it would most likely kick off before I were finished as more resin builds more heat - remember this is a chemical reaction of which the by product to any chemical reaction is heat. Poly resin gets very hot when it kicks off, or cures, if it is too thick and you add to much hardener, it will smoke and actually burn itself. As resin builds heat, it starts to cure faster. I had Wannafish get a cooler set resin, you can get it formulated for different temperatures during application. I prefer a not too fast cure, otherwise your working time can really be short and too fast/hot a cure not as strong/brittle, too slow/cold, doesn't quite cure thoroughly and weak. This probably took two hours or so to roll out, by time I was finishing the starting point was just starting to tack up - perfect by my standards. I stopped by an hour after that and the resin was a bit warm and hardened, but still tacky to the touch - perfect. I want the resin to have time to thoroughly soak into the glass completely, and to have time to soak into and adhere to the old glass as thoroughly as possible for a nice strong and secure bond.

The idea behind all this extra glass is strength. This boat is not real sturdy, the hull is a bit flimsy really, it was built in MInnesota as a lake boat so it wasn't built to take a pounding from chop. Toni wants to be able to chase pinks, chum and coho around the sound and we all know how the conditions can fall apart or change out there pretty quickly. I want her to feel very secure that her boat will be able to handle the rougher water if it needs to and she won't be hearing a bunch of creaks and cracks as she's skimming along on top of the waves. Therefore, I want the hull to be nice and thick. With this new layer of glass covering the entire hull, the stringers will have a nice new bed of glass to adhere to. When the stringers are glassed in, that will add another layer to the hull, it will probably be nearly twice as thick as original. This will make the stringers and all the new glass one integrated system all bonded together. Weight added is negligible, a few pounds, well worth the extra time and labor.

So there you have it, as of this evening this is where it's at. It's been a long road to get to this point, far more sanding and prep than I ever imagined, but old boats are like a box of chocolates, you never know what you're gonna' get. They don't melt all over your pants in the sun however, thank goodness!! I have to be in Tri-cities all next week, but should be home by next weekend for Labor Day. First day back the other side of the hull with get a fresh layer of glass and then we're onto stringers and floor.

Toni's taking us chum fishing next month, we're taking HER BOAT!!

[Bodofish]

That triax cloth is very impressive fiber, how many OZ is it? All of the triax I've laid has been in the 15 to 20 OZ range. I've found it a bit tough on any sharp corners getting it to stay down while the resin goes off, hours of paint brush stippling. Good deep fillets at all joints really helps, the other thing that helps is a very heavy gelled type resin. If you get it from the same MFG most of the time it's compatible with their laminating resins. Trowel it into the joints before layup and press the fiber in. She looks really nice! Toni is very luck to have the help. The boat is turning out awesome!

[Steve Ericsson]

Not sure how heavy the triax is, it was donated and he didn't say but I would guess it's between 15 - 20oz. It is a lot less than some of the heavy woven biax I've used and a dream to work with compared, it lays nice and doesn't soak up a ton of resin. I did have to spend a little time in a spot or two in the corners of the chines, but I did lay a nice heavy coat of resin in there before the cloth went on, plus rolled a heavy coat under the mat first to press it in. I see so many posts with dry glass because guys will lay their mat down and try to roll the resin through it, which is not real easy to do. The proper way is like you mentioned - heavy coat and press mat into resin then roll more on top. I had Toni get a couple of serrated resin rollers since I no longer have any, they help quite a bit to move resin around under the mat and push the air out.

[Steve Ericsson]

The transom holes were definitely air relief from manufacture. My first thoughts were epoxy Dr. Rot holes too, but once I saw that they were partially filled with resin it was pretty clear what they were for. The upper part of each hole was still good plywood, plus they were pretty evenly spaced in a pattern, rot test holes wouldn't be so, I wouldn't think. That is part of the reason I sanded off most of the glass, to uncover these holes so they could be properly filled and to check the overall condition of the plywood. Thankfully, it's very much nice and solid.

[Toni]

The end of August has the hull fiberglassed
"All new glass over the entire hull, double layered/overlapped on top of the heavy CSM laid down the keel earlier for triple layers over the keel for added strength and rigidity, nice fresh and clean palate to build upon."

hull back 8-28-13.jpg (152.69 KiB) Viewed 6054 times

hull 8-28-13.jpg (170.85 KiB) Viewed 6054 times

[Toni]

So onto stringers this week, found a pretty good price on 4x8 marine grade 3/4" locally, so I sprang for a sheet to build the stringers out of. We had some CDX donated, but it wasn't quite up to quality for stringers I felt, however it makes a great layout table over a couple of saw horses, so thank you NWJet for that donation, it's comes in handy!

First step was to get the general layout of the stringer/hull profile, so I made some measurements every foot in length from the transom to the bow end of the outer stringers, then transfered those dimensions to a piece of cardboard to make a template.

first.jpg (83.11 KiB) Viewed 5964 times

That made it fairly easy to draw a nice curve to match the hull fairly closely. These stringers set into the hull chine, so there is a dip/rise where the chine ends, this made these stringers the most difficult and time consuming to build. The inner stringers don't follow a chine, so they won't take nearly as long to build, plus I saved the front half of the inner stringers for templates - trace, cut, install.

second.jpg (73.18 KiB) Viewed 5964 times

third.jpg (79.34 KiB) Viewed 5964 times

Once the template was trimmed to fit how I wanted, the profile was traced onto the marine grade ply and cut out with the jig saw on angle to match the hull angle. The stringers need to be about 11-12' in length, but with 8' plywood a scarf joint would need to be made to lengthen the stringers. This was done by cutting the back end at a 45 degree angle and then routing out the same angle for 3" at half the depth. The same joint was made to the adjoining piece and the two were joined with 5 minute epoxy and some screws to hold it tight until it set up.

[Toni]

fifth.jpg (62.44 KiB) Viewed 5964 times

fourth.jpg (51.21 KiB) Viewed 5964 times

Once the epoxy was good and set, the screws were removed and the excess was sanded off with the angle grinder and a sanding disc. The screw holes will be buried under two layers of glass, so they won't be an issue.

sixth.jpg (43.48 KiB) Viewed 5964 times

[Toni]

seventh.jpg (45.49 KiB) Viewed 5963 times

The scarf joint was made toward the transom were there is less pounding on the hull, however I doubt it would ever be an issue but it makes me feel better putting the joints where the least amount of stress will be on the hull. In case you are wondering, the joint is every bit as strong as the rest of the plywood, it flexes the same as well. I thought about sistering a piece of plywood on the back side of the joint, however that would complicate the glass work. I feel this joint has the same or nearly the same strength as the plywood itself, so I decided against it.

Once the stringers were all trimmed to fit and I was satisfied, they got a good coat of poly resin and were left to sit and tack up.

eighth.jpg (92.66 KiB) Viewed 5963 times

While this took place, I used some 8" wide chop strand mat tape and cut the lengths needed to fair in and bond the stringers to the hull, put some duct tape on the bottom of the floor jigs so they won't stick and set the stringers in place. The stringers are screwed to the jigs to hold them up off the hull and put the top edges even with the outer hull edge strakes where the floor will bond, this way the stringer tops will all be exactly at the same height and on the same plane, which will make for a nice even floor. I talked Trent into getting high on fumes and lending a hand, so he changed out of his work clothes and climbed in the boat and went to work. I had him use a paint brush and paint a nice, thick coat of resin to the hull and the stringers while I came behind him and laid the glass in and wet it out with a 6" roller. We went through a bit of resin, but in not much time we had the outer edges glassed. I figured there was still some daylight left, so I mixed up another tub of resin and we glassed the inner edge too, since we had the time and were already at it. Once set, the stringers will be in solid and they'll get another heavy layer of the triax glass up the full sides and across the full hull between the stringers to add another layer of strength to the hull. With that, these babies aren't going to move a bit.

Transom

stringer 3.jpg (99.6 KiB) Viewed 5963 times

[Toni]

Bow

stringer 2.jpg (109.95 KiB) Viewed 5962 times

You can see in the above pic that the front of the stringers is held down 1/2" with some 1/2" plywood, this area will get a sub-layer of 1/2" flooring to form the opening on floor locker/fish box. The final layer of floor will have a matching cutout but 1" wider all the way around for the lid/cover to fit into. Don't worry, you'll see it come together very soon and it'll all be clear as mud!!

Stringer tabbing/bond. I decided to bond the stringers this way since this is how the original stringers were installed, no bedding. I see a lot of differing views on whether to bed the stringers and bond them to the hull or to hold them off and tab them as I did, I decided to go with the original design. The original stringers lasted 40 years, so the design must have some merit - if they hadn't gotten wet, they would probably still be good. Figure why redesign the wheel, just update it a bit.

stringer 1.jpg (106.95 KiB) Viewed 5962 times

So there we are, up to date as of last evening. I'm hoping to possibly build the inner stringers and put them in Sunday afternoon, weather permitting before I have to leave for Richland on Monday morning for most of the week.

[ChelleDean08]

Beautiful boat! We just sold our little bay liner about a month ago and I've been kicking myself for it ever since lol If you are ever looking for a female companion on a day trip, I don't take up too much space! ;) Have fun and be safe girl!

[Toni]

Beautiful boat! We just sold our little bay liner about a month ago and I've been kicking myself for it ever since lol If you are ever looking for a female companion on a day trip, I don't take up too much space! ;) Have fun and be safe girl!

Will do. But I had this whole summer planned fishing from the boat. It didn't happen so I am trying not to plan anything now.