Suggestions and advice on how to deal with and avoid the dreaded "DOG FISH"

[needabiggerboat]

Man The first two years I fished the sound I never Even saw A dog fish. This year they are all over me and oldhooker.
I am not My self into the "lets carve them up before we throw them back" That was a must and always part of the program when i fished with my grandpa.
Can they come after you again because it sure seems like once you catch one they are all over you.
I have also been told they only go after bait (herring in any form) but won't go after a lure (coyote, or apex)
I also have a very knowledgeable friend at work who was shoked to hear that we had caught dogs on a down rigger.
Is this uncommon? He seems to think that I may have been trolling to slow?
I am placing the blame on too much line behind the ball (40') may not be jenerating enough action.
BREAK IT DOWN, ALL THAT KNOWLEDGE IS NEEDED GOING OUT AGAIN THIS SUNDAY FROM 4:00am TO 12:00.
HELP ME AVOID THE DOG DAYS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[A9]

You can catch dogfish on both lures and bait. They will find your lures, especially if scent is present on them.

A) Move areas
B) Troll a bit faster
C) Deal with em

Try a hootchie behind a flasher. The whipping motion of a hootchie will prevent a Dogfish from being able to get their mouth on your lure. Plus, I've been getting some big fish on Ace Hi Fly's this year...

Having 40' of line behind the ball doesn't do anything to the action. The downrigger ball doesn't do anything to the action of your lure.

Not sure why your going 40' either. 10-20 is plenty. Their are exceptions, like crystal clear water and fishing up near the surface. But for kings down low in the water column, putting more then 25' out behind your clips just harms you, because you have more slack to reel in when your line pops out of the clip due to a bite, etc.

Good luck. I'll be up north of you fishing all weekend. Report back with pictures.

[needabiggerboat]

I was always told that the sent is a must, dog fish or not. You need it to cover your own sent and also attract salmon.
I was trolling at a speed of about 2.5-3.0 mph according to the depth sounder. This has worked for me in the past.
I am willing to try to speed up if you guys think that is on the slow side.

I was running a hoochie on both rods all day and the dogs were loving it. Maybe that goes along with the speed and not getting enough action.
What is a Ace hi fly's ?
I will defenatly report back on the possible improvements as I am shure lots of the guys a interested in avoiding dog hookups.
thanks for you advise A9

[A9]

Sometimes you just can't get away from the doggies. Flounder, shakers and dogfish are all a nuisance.

Scent: I always use it, but I've forgotten to use it and have caught fish on it...

2.5-3.0 mph: Be careful. Often times the tide is pushing you more than you think, so you might be going 3mph but really the majority of your speed is coming from the current, which means your lure isn't moving very fast in comparison to the speed of the water. Sometimes not at all, and with a hootchie, you need your flasher to be whipping around to get that hootchie some action. Best thing to do is watch the blowback of your downrigger wire.

Always troll with the tide, and test the action of your lure at your trolling speed before sending it down on your downrigger.

Regarding the hootchies, try going shorter on the leader. 20-30 inches. 30 lb test leader.

Ace Hi flys = A beefed up Hootchie.

Salmon University put a great article together on em...I don't fish standard hootchies, but love Ace Hi Fly's. I run 3 lures 95% of the time. Coyotes, Coho Killers and Ace Hi Flys. Of course that depends on the

http://www.salmonuniversity.com/pr_prod ... ce-Hi.html


Good luck. Lemme know how you do.

[G-Man]

Just a note. Once I switched over to braided line on my downriggers, my dogfish catch dropped off the table. Tom Nelson, of Salmon University, also mentioned that once they started to use the black boxes their dogfish catch dropped dramatically. One may attribute this to a sharks sensitivity to eletrical fields, which seems to be higher than most other critters that live in the sea. My issue now is dealing with shakers, they seem to be on my gear as soon as I drop it in the water.

[racfish]

Using herring attracts doggies.Butchering a doggie near your boat attracts even more.I catch a doggie I cut the leader and off it goes.I found using herring scent works as well as fresh herring but no hake or doggies.

[Dustin07]

what do dogfish taste like?

[wolverine]

All dog fish die if they go for my gear. If I know that salmon are around I'll speed up a mph to see if that gets the doggies to leave my gear alone. If I'm not sure that salmon are around I'll move rather than having to run the gear constantly to get rid of the sharks. After disposing of the shark I change the leader immediately as the teeth are sharp and the skins abrasive.
Are they edible? The Brits use them in their fish & chips. If you are really fish hungry they are marginally (to NW tastes) edible if you soak the filets in milk over night to get rid of the urine taste. Doggies don't have kidneys so the flesh is full of it.

[curado]

mmm pee flavored shark. YUCK. possesion bar has alot of them on it

[fishingmachine]

I have gotten lucky this year and haven got one.
Ive trolled plug cut and whole herring right on the bottom and everything else that usually gets them. Even when people around me are getting them im not.

[curado]

like wolverine said move from the area if you are catching them i have caught them on divers if you hook one on herring, go to just hoochies of lures or ace high flies

[fishingmachine]

Great advice you are getting.
Move around unless you know there are fish there.
Another option is dont fish as deep if its early morning fish shallower and that can lead to salmon and not doggies

[needabiggerboat]

This is great information, I am stoked.

A9- you may have something there with your notes about the tide flow.
We were using a 10lb ball on the electric scotty and a 8lb ball on the manual scotty. I will take a good look at the wire angle sunday and try to maintain a good rake. What is a good wire angle to shoot for.
I will let you know all about sundays action ( balls in the water at 4:30 am )


Side note question----- What is the deal with the whine or hum that comes from the wire some times. It realy trips me out. Will it help attract fish or send them running? My best day on the sound was with a 6lb ball and it was whineing the entire day (loudly) all six fish were caught on that rod and not a fish or a hit on the other. P.s. no dog fish eather.



fishingmachine
I wish I was you with you dog gone luck (funny)
I am interested in a recommended depth to start with in those first and best hours of the day (4:30 to 7:30)
Sound like you have a way to stay dog free so fill us in


G-man
Last time out I brought my fluke multimeter with to check the wire voltages
Electric scotty was at .55 volts
manual scotty was at .65 volts ( I think this is a good voltage )
braided line on downriggers That sounds like a good plan since some of the wire has started to frey
How is the cost compaired to wire and were is a local place to have it put on.


Lastly is it legal to chop up a caught dog if you don,t keep it? I am leaning to the no side.

[needabiggerboat]

Ok crazy note A9 and I joined Washingtonlakes.com on the same day. We have the same Birthday?
Crazy man!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[fishingmachine]

well for kings i have usually one rod at 65ft and one at 95 in the morning sometimes 45 ft

[curado]

no it is not legal to make minced meat of doggies

[Gonefishing]

This would have been a decent thread for Swede to respond to. I've been gone for awhile (not gone fishing unfortunately) and see that he's gone for good :(

It would have been nice to see what his response would had been granted I'd have to have a universal interpreter to figure out what he was saying between the :batman: :cyclopsan

[Jake Dogfish]

Us Dogfish like it slow and low... We like scent as well. I think the tips above are good just don't drag the bottom slow with something smelly or the dog pack will be on your trail...

[A9]

This is great information, I am stoked.

A9- you may have something there with your notes about the tide flow.
We were using a 10lb ball on the electric scotty and a 8lb ball on the manual scotty. I will take a good look at the wire angle sunday and try to maintain a good rake. What is a good wire angle to shoot for.
I will let you know all about sundays action ( balls in the water at 4:30 am )


Side note question----- What is the deal with the whine or hum that comes from the wire some times. It realy trips me out. Will it help attract fish or send them running? My best day on the sound was with a 6lb ball and it was whineing the entire day (loudly) all six fish were caught on that rod and not a fish or a hit on the other. P.s. no dog fish eather.


braided line on downriggers That sounds like a good plan since some of the wire has started to frey
How is the cost compaired to wire and were is a local place to have it put on.


Lastly is it legal to chop up a caught dog if you don,t keep it? I am leaning to the no side.

What about the tide flow are you wondering??

A good angle can be anywhere from straight down to 45 degrees. It depends significantly on depth, speed and current, as well as ball size. Like I said, I always test my gear in the water next to the boat before sending it down. For kings, I like a nice roll in my flasher, I don't like going fast enough to have it whipping around like for Coho. If it means having a 45 degree blowback, so be it, if it means a 10 degree blowback, same thing. Usually somewhere between 15-45 degrees is where I am, but obviously that depends on depth. I run 10 lb lead on my downriggers and wire.

The whine/hum is the vibration of the wire. Haven't figured out if it hurts or helps fishing. I don't mind it, even when it does get annoying. One option is to turn to braid. Scotty's downrigger wire is AWFUL. Swap it out for another brand of wire or for some THICK braid. It is expensive, but obviously, so is wire and if your wire snaps on you, there goes a $10 clip, $30 DR ball and a $10 terminal kit to get a snap and bumper on the end of your line.

As said before, kings are more structure oriented, and I always like to be down low in the water column. Usually 5-10 feet off the bottom on one lure, and 20-40 feet up on the next one. As always, it depends on where I'm marking fish and bait, but that is where I do best. And remember to factor in blowback, ie don't put 90 feet of line out in 100 feet of water if your trying to get right off the bottom. Learn how your boat/downriggers handle blowback and eventually you will figure out where your balls are running....

Hope you are getting some out there this morning. I fished hard Friday night and Saturday morning and came up with only a few small coho and a pink...I hope those fish come in soon from the straights...

[G-Man]

For non-metal braided line I've been using the tuff-line XP. You can buy a 300 yard roll in 130lb test or more for under $45 and use it to spool 2 downriggers with 450 feet each. Scotty sells downrigger super line for like $45 and you only get 250' so this is a no brainer. A9 is steering you right, check the gear next to the boat and adjust your speed to get the action you want. The angle you get on your downrigger will be dependant on many factors and speed in only one of them. The gear you use generates drag as does the ball and line, then you factor in depth, speed and current. Remember to troll with the current whenever possible to get consistent action with your gear. Once you get used to your setup, you'll be able to judge the speed of your troll by the angle of your downrigger line.